Arctic Bay

se ne rendono conto ora?

dove sono andati a finire su smogon, tutti quei posts in cui si manifestava la più assoluta semplicità nel counterare quel coso usando SR e Priorities?

i miei team deboli ai vari tipi di salamence non hanno perso una sola battle da oggi alle 15 fino ad ora

secondo me la sesta gen non arriva

le ultime parole famose.

non significa che smetteranno di farci giochi però

vo ricordo
mistery dyungeon
ranger
le merdate pokémon uscite per wii
etc

la seconda preferibilmente
è più divertente  >:D

però prima dovete farmi finire il vgc italy... tanto manca poco visto che tutti danno furfé...
vi supplico  :'(

furfé

però sul tuo avatar c'è un particolare che credo sia trascurabile

axel bib ho xapito il 18esimo domani mi dici la risp <3

As strong as the walls in OU are, removing strong sweepers like Salamence is just asking to turn OU into a circle-jerk of stall. Salamence is strong, but it's got plenty of weak points that have been discussed repeatedly as well. Case closed.

what I've seen him do now, he seems relatively easy to beat. the 'wait for Outrage' strategy is actually easy.

Salamence sure is a great pokemon, however it has checks and so should be OU. as Chou said this metagame is going to turn into massive stall if the best sweepers are taken out.

It isn't really Salamence I have a problem with, it's the plethora of Dragon types. Individually, none of them are broken, but together, they overload the metagame a little.

Salamence's defense is not at all the best. Its speed, without Scarf or Dragon Dance, is not a bit impressive either, as there are many Pokemon that outspeed it (not saying it's bad though, just not impressive.)

Clefable has a giant movepool too, and maybe an even better ability than Salamence... Anyways, there's no Doubt that Salamence is a great Pokemon, but it shouldn't be SHOVELED into comparisons with Rayquaza and Garchomp. Rayquaza has 150 ATK and SPA, as well as access to ExtremeSpeed. Garchomp, on the other hand, has an ability that makes him to not get attacked 20% of the time even when an 100% accuracy move is used, much better defenses and HP, immunity to Thunder Wave AND resistances to Stealth Rock.

In general, I think Salamence is a great Pokemon, but not broken enough yet to be tested for Uber.

I wouldn't complain much if the site staff decided to test salamence, but personally, I think that scizor should be tested before salamence among the actual OU threats. Weakness to stealth rock really limits salamence potential.

We should stop nominating things for Suspect status because "they might be broken", honestly. Maybe Salamenceless is a little different than with Salamence, maybe SRless is subjectively "better" than with SR. That shouldn't be the issue though. You ban things when there is some sort of problem caused by their presence in OU.

Either way, Stealth Rock Weakness, 4X Ice weakness, mediocre support movepool, inability to completely sweep a team, etc... and yes, you can switch into Salamence.

Salamence is in no way uber, if you figure out what type of salamence it is its easy to counter, even mixed ones you can counter, just make sure it doesnt set up on you.

Weak to stealth rock. Not immune to paralyzation. Not very bulky. Can be OHKOed by CB Scizor's bullet punch after SR. Regardless of how strong it is, it is slow and frail. Scarftran out-speeds and KOs with HP ice.

If you can't handle Salamence, then you need to work on your team a bit more. Scout its set (or wait for it to Outrage) and you'll be fine.

Against DDMence, the standard Porygon2 can come in on DD, undo the attack boost by tracing Intimidate, and stall out any attack, even Life Orbed Outrage, with Recover until Salamence confuses itself, or just take a hit and OHKO with Ice Beam. So that's a 100% counter that isn't all that gimmicky or specialized right there. SpecsMence is countered silly by Blissey, no question about that one. MixMence is a bit tougher, but it can be lured into using Draco Meteor on a special wall or bulky steel type and is then walled fairly easily by anything that could beat DDMence, due to its halved Special Attack. ANY of these Mences can be revenge killed by CB Scizor, Mamoswine, Mixape, random scarfers, etc. if you goof up your prediction and lose somebody. And every time it's forced out of battle it will likely lose 25% of its HP when it comes back in, plus possibly weather and Life Orb damage.

So, in conclusion, Salamence is not uncounterable. Perfectly good, non-gimmicky Pokemon can take it down if you know what you're doing (and what they're doing).

What makes Salamence so deadly is it versatility. Alright, you've lost a Pokemon, but you've got 5 others and you know what to expect. He's not unstoppable.

Salamence is undoubtedly a powerful Pokemon and keeping it in check is indeed a difficult proposition, but anything Bulky can usually take whatever set it is. Gyarados, Hippowdon, Skarmory, Pory2, anything that you can bring in just to discover what set is being used. Once the set is discovered, it makes it a whole lot easier to deal with.

Then of course, there is the foolproof-unless-it-has-yache Ice Shard. Salamence is great, top-tier, but far from invincible.

Having a Steel-type waiting in the wings is usually the first method of defense, as you’re able to resist those powerful Dragon-type attacks. Pokémon like Bronzong have less to fear when facing physical Salamence, and you’ll often get the opportunity to set up Stealth Rock. Stealth Rock will remove a quarter of Salamence’s health every time it switches in, so if you can limited the number of times Salamence can enter the field of play, you can further limit how much damage it can do to you. Choice Scarf Heatran can come in on any move not named Earthquake, Brick Break or the rare Hydro Pump and threaten to Dragon Pulse in return. Obviously you're going to be in a bit of trouble if Salamence Dragon Dances instead, however. Not many Pokémon can switch in on Salamence and defeat it on the next turn, so revenge killing is often the way go to.

Choice Band Scizor is one of the primary candidates thanks to Bullet Punch, which will do upwards of 60% damage to your average Salamence. Mamoswine and Weavile have access to Ice Shard, so will obviously take down Salamence no matter how many Dragon Dances it can get in. In Scizor's case, you can actually switch it in once or even twice if you're a bulkier variant. Being able to take the odd Outrage might save you in a pinch. Choice Scarf Jirachi, Flygon, and Heatran are great revenge killers to eliminate Salamence with provided it doesn't boost its Speed. Blissey stops the rare Choice Specs version in its tracks. Generally, you’ll just want to figure out which set you’re facing without losing crucial team members, and use your most suitable counter, and/or revenge killer to deal with it; Stealth Rock is pretty widespread these days anyway and will significantly lower Salamence’s opportunites to threaten your team.

Salamence is pretty much forced to use Outrage if it wants to sweep on the physical side of the spectrum, suffers from Stealth Rock damage, etc.

Garchomp is a potent sweeper in its own right as well, and isn't forced to rely on the mediocre Dragon Dance + Life Orb Outrage Salamence needs in order to deliver the same power Garchomp can do with just one Swords Dance.

SR says hi to you using Mence to hit-n-run.

Salamence is more prone to do so since you'll be losing nearly 33% of your health each time you switch in, factoring Sandstorm.

Salamence is a worse hit&run attacker because of...yeah Stealth Rock. Sure he might do more damage on that 1 turn he switches in thanks to his power on both spectrums, but taking 25% to switch in?

Salamence is easily worn down by Stealth Rocks and Life Orb damage (forget Sandstorm for a little). Also, offensive Salamence has no business coming in on so many threats. Even Blissey is a constant threat with random Thunderwaves or Toxics or even Ice Beams flying around. Hell, Seismic Toss and Flamethrower take off enough damage with Stealth Rocks to limit Mence's abilities. Also, Mence must rely on Outrage to OHKO Blissey without a boost, making possibly the most viable switch-in an issue, as after an Outrage the Steel-types come in to kill off the dragon.

The way I see it, Salamence is less uber than Latias, and Latias is no uber.

But the offensive mence is weak as hell early game. You can roughly kill one poke, because you'll be on k.o. range with LO recoil and SR damage.
Bulky Mences usually doesn't have Dragon Dance, so it's easily k.oed by something like Tyranitar, because it fails to ohko with Earthquake and dies to Pursuit, Stone Edge or keeps being checked by Earthquake if it roosts.
If you ask me, Salamence is less uber than Gyarados, because you can kill a +6 Atk +6 Spe Mence with one single priority move. But you can't kill a +6 Atk +6 Spe Gyarados with any priority or scarfed poke.

Salamence can never run a set like Garchomp, and it's flying type makes it even easier to kill, since it takes 1x and 4x from the most commom attacks in his metagame...Thunderbolt and Ice Beam.

I stand my my statement that Mence is not Uber. Mence's checks are common eoungh, as is one of its counters (Scizor), that the metagame is capable of accepting Salamence. The popularity of Mence's checks/counters I judge to be more of the competence of the checks in the rest of battle rather than because of Salamence.

Face it, Salamence is a SUPER pokemon, that's why some tournments make 1 SUPER only, but he is OU, he might be the Dragon King of OU, but he's OU. There's no point in doing suspect rating to a pokemon that isn't uber material.

Either way, Stealth Rock Weakness, 4X Ice weakness, mediocre support movepool, inability to completely sweep a team, etc... and yes, you can switch into Salamence.

The way I see it, Salamence is less uber than Latias, and Latias is no uber.

fanculo
XDXDXD

anche gf merda che mi batte col counter team  ;)


btw LOL girano voci che i prossimi uber dovrebbero essere jirachi, lucario e kingdra.


Ciò significa che inevitabilmente anche suicune diverrà subito dopo uber poiché senza "counters" con le palle... sono solo voci o c'è un fondo di verità?


ho preso spunto da qui http://www.pokemoncentral.it/forum/index.php?topic=6476.0


ah umbreon be proud to be OU  ;)


ultimi ubers della settimana


celebi

raikou e suicune con cmind


jirachi con cmind


CURSELAX AHAHAHAHAHAH


P.S. SU QUESTI SCHERZO

sì secondo smogon umbreon è OU, e non capisco come possa visti tutti i tricker ed u-turner che ci sono in giro

va che la uber tier si crea basandosi sull'OU.

non è che siccome Salamence è outclassato da Rayquaza allora non è Uber...

Btw, se solo ci fossero un altro paio di tipi resistenti a dragon e non deboli a fuoco (che so, Rock? Water?) sarebbe molto meno centralizzante.

Dammi una buona ragione per cui umbreon dovrebbe essere uber

[...]
Dammi una buona ragione per cui umbreon dovrebbe essere uber

no ma cioè cmcune haznoweak bisogna bannare pure lui o almeno tutte le versioni con cmind

no ma cioè cmcune haznoweak bisogna bannare pure lui o almeno tutte le versioni con cmind

dovrebbe andare giù con zapdos che però è inesistente (per poco credo)

va giù un cazzo che dopo un cmind la versione offensiva ohkoa per poco zapdos con il beam

se zapdos entra sul calm mind, zapdos perde l'1vs1.

I came

Peccato che doveva essere così fin dall'inizio, farlo adesso è troppo tardi con la prossima generazione che sostituirà dp

io invece penso che tutti questi ban sono stupidi e inutili

mah a lucario dovrebbero togliere direttamente swords dance, anche senza ice punch con cc+bp+es è una belva mostruosa

Bannati mence e latias infernape si divora l' OU senza alcun problema  :ohno

non mi risulta che tu abbia mai saputo giocare dp

bel troll signor dig weavile

hai mai preso un calcolatore in vita tua?
lo sai che salamence è 2hkoato dalla blast senza stealth?
lo sai che salamence è più lento di infernape?

ho detto ice punch perché già così inizia ad avere qualcosa che assomiglia ad un counter, gliscor.
anche se hp ice fa la stessa cosa, MA nessuno lo usa perché smogon non lo consiglia nel primo set ^_^

se è per questo è anche ucciso dall'hp ice (che ha anche 100% di precisione)

nape richiede la specs + modest nature x 2hkoare mence 0/0 se non ci sono le strealth btw
e IL 2hko non pè nemmeno gatrantito se mence ha i lefties XDDDD

Tanto hanno creato AgilityMixCario che baita sia GLiscor sia i Rotom-A

Direi che è una soluzione meno drastica che metterlo uber.

Alright, you've lost a Pokemon, but you've got 5 others and you know what to expect. He's not unstoppable.

qualcuno mi spiega perché machamp femmina ha i coglioni  ???

Invidioso eh?

Comunque ho notato che DPPt è effettivamente irrecuperabile, visto che ban dopo ban sono emersi SEMPRE dei problemi con certi threats che senza altri threats centralizzano/vattelapescano il metagame, non è così? :°D:à:Dà:D°D:

se fossi femmina non mi piacerebbe avere i coglioni.

detto ciò hai ragione su dppt, bestie come mixape, cmindcune timid max satk e max speed e dragonite (che imho dopo una danza non invidia minimamente mence, avendo anche una priority odiosissima come extremespeed) centralizzano il mg e rendono dppt un circolo vizioso.

Non ho voglia di cercare, chi sono i problemi del momento?

Non ho voglia di cercare, chi sono i problemi del momento?